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Ken Tumin founded the Bank Deals Blog in 2005 and has been passionately covering the best deposit deals ever since. He is frequently referenced by The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, and other publications as a top expert, but he is first and foremost a fellow deal seeker and member of the wonderful community of savers that frequents DepositAccounts.

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Survey of the Best CD Rates for February 1, 2013

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With the start of a new month, several credit unions changed their rates. Unfortunately, most of those were cuts. However, I was happy to see PenFed holding steady with its CD rates. Although it's not guaranteed, it's likely that these PenFed CD rates will hold through at least February. PenFed's 1-, 2- and 3-year CD rates continue to be the best deals for nationally available CDs.

Not all credit unions were like PenFed. Two all-access credit unions made large cuts to their CD rates. Communitywide Federal Credit Union reduced its 5-year CD APY from 2.00% to 1.20%, and its special 1.70% 49-month CD has changed to a 1.00% APY 46-month CD. Due to these low rates, I've removed Communitywide from my list.

The other all-access credit union to make large rate cuts is Pen Air Credit Union. Its 5-year CD yield fell from 1.85% to 1.65%. This cut wasn't as bad as the other one, but it was large enough for me to delist the CD from the list below.

The best short-term CD deal isn't actually a CD, but a money market/checking account. EverBank continues to offer an intro rate of 1.25% that's guaranteed for the first 6 months for new customers. This applies to balances up to $100K for the checking account and up to $50K for the money market account. A new customer can open both accounts at the same time to get 1.25% for a total balance of $150K. Due to the 6-month rate guarantee, I've been listing it on the "under 1-year CD" list.

The highest CD rate that's nationally available continues to be at Citizens State Bank which is offering a 5-year CD with a 2.05% APY. This is a small Florida bank, but they are accepting deposits nationwide and the CDs can be opened online. Before January the bank required a $100K minimum deposit to qualify for a 2.00% APY. The minimum for this 2.05% APY is now just $1,000.

Local CD Deals

Two of the noteworthy credit unions that cut rates this week were Wings Financial Credit Union (most branches in Seattle & Minneapolis Metro areas) and One Source Federal Credit Union (branches in El Paso, Texas). Wings Financial CD rates fell by 10 bps, and One Source rates fell by 25 bps.

In addition to credit unions, there was one noteworthy bank rate cut. American Eagle Bank of Chicago reduced its 5-year CD rates by 25 bps. The relationship yield is now 1.75%. Due to these rate cuts, I removed this bank from the list.

Not all rate changes were cuts. University of Iowa Community Credit Union replaced its 1.35% APY 21-month CD special with a 1.75% APY 19-month CD special. An extra rate of 10 to 20 bps is available for jumbo deposits.

I added five new CDs to the list. The one with the best rate is an IRA-only deal. It's available at South Florida Federal Credit Union, and it has a 2.01% APY 2-year IRA CD.

Another good deal is at Melrose Cooperative Bank in Massachusetts. It's offering a special 1.50% APY 1-year CD and a regular 4-year and 5-year CD with a 2.00% APY.

Another Texas credit union has a top 5-year CD rate. It's Security First Credit Union in South Texas, and it's offering a Jumbo 5-year CD yield of 2.43%. This is just under the highest 5-year CD yield of 2.53% at Encompass Credit Union in Central Indiana.

The last two deals aren't great when compared to internet rates, but they're competitive when compared to rates from other local banks. The first deal is a 1.00% APY 1-year CD at The National Republic Bank of Chicago. The other deal is a 1.01% APY 1-year CD at CapitalSource Bank in Southern California.

Long-Term CD Break Strategy

For the short-term CDs in my lists, you might notice CDs with the note "5-year CD closed after X years". These take into account the yield after the early withdrawal penalty is applied. Since Ally Bank's 5-year CD only has a 60-day interest penalty, it's still a good deal when closed early even with the recent rate cuts.

The risks of planning for early withdrawals of long-term CDs were recently highlighted by the deposit agreement change at Ally. The risks have also been seen at credit unions which have raised the early withdrawal penalties on existing CDs. I have more details in this blog post.

Note About the CD Survey

As I described in my rate table overview, you can use our CD rate tables to find the best rates for both nationally available CDs and local CDs. This CD survey blog posts are intended to highlight nationwide CD deals that may not be apparent in the tables. For example, I'll include the post-penalty yields of a few long-term CDs.

The CD survey blog posts are also intended to highlight the local CD deals that are available in large metro areas. There are many high CD rates, but most of these are at small banks in rural areas or at small credit unions with very narrow fields of membership. In these local CD surveys, my focus is on local CD deals that are in big cities or that are available in large areas of a state.

Yields Accurate as of February 1, 2013

Under 1-Year CD Rates

  • Noteworthy Local Deals

1-Year CD Rates

  • Noteworthy Local Deals

18-month CD Rates

  • Noteworthy Local Deals

2-Year CD Rates

  • Noteworthy Local Deals

3-Year CD Rates

  • Noteworthy Local Deals

4-Year CD Rates

  • Noteworthy Local Deals

5-Year CD Rates

  • Noteworthy Local Deals

Over 5-Year CD Rates

  • Noteworthy Local Deals

Note: All rates listed above are Annual Percentage Yields (APY) which factor in compounding.


  Tags: CD rates

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Comments
31 Comments.


Comment #2 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
After reading this blog entry on CDs, Sandy, I can understand why you want to learn how to buy platinum. Like you, I've given up on CDs, and use Ken's site solely to find the best transactional accounts, with good ACH, customer service, etc. Since I ended the major part of my participation in the fiat currency Ponzi Scheme earlier than most other savers, I have a bit of experience that I can share with you.

Platinum, gold, silver and palladium can all be purchased from any coin shop. You can buy coins and small bars or medallions and take them home with you. You can also buy them online from Kitco or a myriad of other sources.

You can also force short sellers at the NYMEX and COMEX futures markets to make delivery to you lots consisting of 50 ounce platinum bars, one per futures contract, 100 ounce gold or palladium bars, and/or 5,000 ounce silver bars. You can "play" the futures markets, by opening an account with a full futures broker that can make deliveries. It is very important to establish that they will deliver, because many firms, like TDAmeritrade, claim to allow you to trade futures, but refuse to engage in the tasks needed to perfect deliveries. Go with a real commodities broker, not a stock brokerage house dabbling in futures.

The best time to buy metals is when the international casino banking cartel does one of its habitual "hit" jobs on the price. They do this regularly by allowing huge leverage in the futures markets, and then selling huge numbers of short contracts, at opportune times, to force a crash in price. The folks that gamble at futures markets usually set so-called "stop-loss" orders at set prices, long in advance, and the investment banks know exactly where those stops are. So, they bombard the market, on occasion, with paper gold, silver and/or platinum and palladium in order to trigger those stops and cascade the price of the metal downward. That's why you should be a buyer wheneveryou see a few weeks worth of dramatically falling prices. It is important to realize that all of that is fake, and that you can make tons of money by ignoring it and buying. You can also pick up huge quantities of metal at artificially low prices, in these futures markets, and if you've got enough cash to cover your purchase, and that is where keeping large sums of money in the best transactional bank accounts, listed on this site, comes into play.

When you deal in futures markets, I think, you need to have yourself fully covered by cash "in the bank", if things don't turn out the way you expect. Otherwise, you risk getting fleeced by the Wall Street casino banks, who manipulate the prices. The biggest problem, however, with using futures markets to buy metals is the rampant fraud among futures brokers. Examples include MF Global and PFG Best, which managed to steal huge sums of money from their clients when they went bankrupt.

So, if you want to avoid the corruption of futuers markets, another way to invest in platinum is with one of the physical ETFs. There are now two available for American investors. One is the "Sprott" physical platinum/palladium fund, which has its metal stored at the Royal Canadian Mint, and the PPLT (call symbol) which stores its metals at JP Morgan Chase vaults in London and Zurich. I've bought shares of PPLT, at various times in the past, but, frankly, since I don't trust JP Morgan (it is regularly accused of manipulating the gold/silver markets on behalf of its client, the Federal Reserve) to actually have the gold, silver or platinum they say they have, I would buy the Sprott Physical Platinum Trust, now, for short term investments.

The upside of the ETFs are that they are easy to trade, so, if you are looking for an investment you expect to last for anything from a few months to less than 2 years or so, they are a cheap way to buy metal for the short term. The big downside of the ETFs is that they charge about 1/2% per year in maintenance fees. That is far more than you pay to store metals in most privately contracted warehouses like Via Mat or Brinks. It is infinitely more than it costs to keep the metals in your safe deposit box, or at home. You can insure safe deposit kept metals for about $1,500 per year per million in value. Sprott's fund is insured by the good faith and credit of the Royal Canadian Mint, a crown corporation, but PPLT metals are stored at JP Morgan without insurance so, again, another reason to prefer the Sprott fund.

Savers tend to believe that metals are a bad way to save because they don't pay overt interest. However, iit has been established historically that every episode of monetary inflation has been following by an equal amount of price inflation, even though the lag between the two can be several years. The monetary base of the USA has been expanded by some 400% since 2008 and you can be sure that all of this expansion will eventually show up in price inflation. It is just a matter of time, and that is why, long term, there is much less risk in buying otherwise "volatile" precious metals, than there is in leaving your money in a CD.

Given that the current real inflation rate (overt price increases and downsized containers) is about 9 % per year, the probability of much higher (possibly triple digit) price inflation in the future as a result of the current 400% monetary inflation from 2008 to now, the probability of much more monetary inflation coming out of the irresponsible Federal Reserve, and the almost zero rates offered by banks, precious metals are much better "stores of value" than CDs.

 

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Comment #3 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
Let me give you a quote from one of the most important economic books ever written:

"just as the vastness of money-wealth is essential to the success of an inflationary tax, so too is the numb insentience of its holders. Lenders never seem to understand what is happening in an inflation, no matter how long it continues or how explosively it compounds itself. They increase their interest rates as a crude way of defending themselves, but they never increase their interest rates enough. The lender habitually seems to think that the loss of value of money wealth is about to end, although the government cannot permit it to end. Each fresh quantum leap to higher interest rates so dazzles the lender that he believes yields will never be so high again; in fact, in most cases they will not soon be so low again. In Germany (1919-23 hyperinflation - W) until the day the inflation finally ended lenders were continuously losing real value by lending, even at interest rates above 22 percent per day. So perversely does this work that the money wealth actually grows faster, the more vigorously the government mines it by inflation. It is like a breeder reactor in atomic energy which produces more fuel than it consumes. The more the government steals from lenders, the more enthusiastically they lend. The money wealth of the United States which stood at only about $1.8 trillion in 1962, when the inflation (of the 1960s- W) began, had increased to $3.2 trillion by 1971."


Quote is from the world-famous economics book - Parsson, Jens, Dying of Money (Wellspring Press 1974). Every high level executive at the top tier of investment banks such as Credit Suisse, UBS, Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan Chase, Morgan Stanley, Barclays, etc. has read it. Have you? Before you buy another CD, I suggest you get a copy and read it.

 

 

1
Comment #4 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
I cannot help but quote one more paragraph from the famous economics work quoted above. On page 97, it is written:

"That holders of money wealth are the sheep to be shorn in an inflation is a natural consequence of Lord Keynes' rather hostile attitude toward rentiers. He thought of them as idle rich men and coupon-clippers, who were fundamentally less useful than active entrepreneurs or workers. Ironically, however, the rentiers are not the rich men, and it is not the rich who pay. The rich tend to be relatively bright men and therefore to be net debtors, not creditors, in an inflation. The dull-witted rentiers who stand still for the shearing are the more modest savers of lower income, even the workers themselves. Pension plans, savings deposits, and life insurance companies alone accounted for more than $700 billion of the net money wealth of the United States in 1971. These are what the less wealthy savers invest in, and those who do are the rentiers. The rentiers who pay for an inflation are not the high-income classes but the low. Karl Helfferich observed that the same was true of the German inflation. It is a strange perversion of Keynes and of standard liberalism to find that their assault falls on the small wealth of the smallest citizens, frequently for the direct benefit of the very rich rentiers such as stock speculators."

 

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Comment #5 by ytytytyt posted on
ytytytyt
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Dear Wanderer,

Thanks for the book recommendation! It is available at URL below.

http://ebookbrowse.com/dying-of-money-lessons-of-the-great-german-and-american-inflations-pdf-d120544116

Yours Truly,
Anonymous

1
Comment #6 by ytytytyt posted on
ytytytyt
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Dear Wanderer.

>> The folks that gamble at futures markets usually set so-called
>> "stop-loss" orders at set prices, long in advance, and the
>> investment banks know exactly where those stops are. So, they
>> bombard the market, on occasion, with paper gold, silver
>> and/or platinum and palladium in order to trigger those stops
>> and cascade the price of the metal downward.

Yes, I had heard/read about this in the past.  But, I could not find reliable underlying data regarding this.  Do you have any publicly available data that shows this? 

Looks like around 12/29/2012 movement in Platinum was a extreme, and around 10/15/2012 similar thing appears to happened to Palladium.  Did you notice paper flood in futures around this time-frame?

Yours Truly,
Anonymous

2
Comment #7 by klink posted on
klink
Melrose Co-Op must have seen this blog spot. Effective 2 Feb the 1yr CD rate is 0.750%.

4
Comment #8 by Anonymous posted on
Anonymous
Wanderer...............There is so much drivel in all the pseudo advice that I don't know where to start or finish. The idea that you can somehow "time the market", "buy low sell high"  etc is all perfectly logical & applies to virtually every investment class. It is also extremely effective MOST of the time. unfortunately............once every decade or so this type of strategy will essentially bankrupt you or leave you in the type of financial scenario where you have to wait decades to recoup your investment. Anyyone that can understand a precious metal chart dating back 30-40 years will see that this is true..................& certainly not resticted to precious metals. The difference is that with precious metals, you're sitting around getting zero interest, zero dividends while it languishes year after year.

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Comment #9 by ytytytyt posted on
ytytytyt
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Dear Anonymous - #8,

When an investor keeps holding the asset, no matter how severe the decline, then s/he will most likely face the scenario you've described.

However, a trader will face such a scenario only if s/he fails to (a) keep on selling high, and/or (b) place and execute a stop-loss. I believe most prudent traders will have the discipline to keep seling the asset high, and will always place a stop-loss to get out at a tolerable loss, rather than face a loss that will amount to bankruptcy.

Indeed ... It is true that precious metal earns no interest and no dividends, however is it likely that it rather than languishing, it appreciates in value.  If/when such a thing happens, then "pool" accounts allow the trader to sell quite easily.  If one has the actual bullian, then the process of selling is a bit slower, but if one can do it, then s/he can get a decent profit.  The ETFs that are backed by physical metal, make the process even more convenient.  ETFs make the process as simple as trading common stocks.

Yours Truly,
Anonymous

3
Comment #10 by Anonymous posted on
Anonymous
Yours Truly............The nature of "assets" coupled with the fact that all currencies devalue to one extent or another.............makes it almost inevitable that all asset classes will appreciate given enough time. The question is how much time & how long of a time horizon a person has in order to be reasonably certain that it will appreciate to the extent necessary for a decent return. There is also the psychological factor that we as human beings often lack the discipline to follow any strategy that underperforms for protracted periods of time.......................but that's another topic for another time. Obviously I know that you know all this. 

I also have no issue with anyone who chooses to make precious metals the vehicle in which they save. The only issue I have is with people who seem to think that precious metals are the answer to all ills or those people who naively assume the run up in precious metals prices of the last decade to be "normal" or necessarily indicative of some future certainty.  These types of scenarios are frankly no more sophisticated than taking any run up in the price of any asset class & drawing a straight line upwards. That's all I'm saying.

3
Comment #16 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
#10,

One more thing...I bought at $1,400, but platinum is still currently priced a few bucks cheaper than the average cost for its miners to take the metal out of the ground, purify it, and make it into a bar. Next year, based on existing union contracts and price announcments by the electric company in S. Africa, where 70% of the world's platinum is mined, the "all-in" cost is scheduled to rise about 10%, meaning that it will cost about $1,900 per ounce to produce a bar or sponge of platinum. I don't dispute that assets rise and fall, especially the metals, because they are so heavily manipulated in the short run. But, can you seriously say that miners will continue to mine the stuff at a loss? They will keep closing mines, if demand falls, until a profit can be achieved. But, demand is rising, not falling, when looked at on a world-wide basis, so I think that its a pretty safe bet over the next 5 years. In contrast, a CD, even at the current "low" inflation rate of 9%, is guaranteed to lose you about 7% of the value of your money each and every year.

1
Comment #11 by ytytytyt posted on
ytytytyt
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Dear Anonymous - #10,

Indeed ... Your point is well taken. I do not think, and neither do I advocate that metals are answrs to all ills. The rise of the gold almost was in tandem with State Street making GLD for gold.  I would not consider the rise to be "normal" at all.  It is likely that the price of gold will collapse in a hurry if a major sovernign nation starts offloading significant portion of their national gold reserve.

True ... doing disciplined algorithmic trading is not always easy.

I consider the metals are just another asset class with less correlation to broad stock market. Pretty much like the asset class of Certificates/CDs, that has no correlation to stock market.

Yours Truly,
Anonymous

3
Comment #14 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
Anonymous #10, gold, silver, platinum and palladium will continue to rise in value until the monetary inflation is equaled by the price inflation. Since we have had 400% monetary inflation since 2008 (and it is continuing upward), and only about 26% worth of price inflation (the real inflation rather than the bogus CPI calculated by the Bureau of Labor Statistics), there is still a long way to go. Once all the monetary inflation is priced, assuming the government stops inflating, it will be time to sell the metals. Historically, in the prior big monetary inflation in the USA, this happened in 1980 when most of the inflation of the 60s and 70s was finally priced into the system. The metals went far above their equilibrium level, as all bull market assets always do, and "collapsed" to an average of just over 12 times what their prices had been in 1970 for the next 20 years.

1
Comment #17 by Anonymous posted on
Anonymous
Wanderer.............So please give us a number or at least a range as to what YOU view the "fair value" for say Gold.........should be TODAY since you seem to be implying that it is substantially undervalued &/or that there is potentially lots of upside because it hasn't fully priced in the "monetary inflation", as you put it. What is your number then?  $2000?, $5000?  $10,000? 

I just want to understand where you're coming from & where your thinking is leading. 

2
Comment #19 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
#17,

It is not hard to say where gold is going but, rather, when it is going there. Based on the previous monetary inflation that happened in 2000-2008, gold was fully priced at around $1,500 per ounce. But, obviously, we've had a lot more since then. I haven't done the calculation, but it will be very much higher than where it is now. I am sure it will eventually reach 5 figures, but, whether or not it will collapse, from there, to maybe $3,500 or so, as it did in 1980, or whether it stays there as necessary to balance the accounts of the various inflating central banks is in question. It all depends on the cental banker wild card. With gold, we are at a time period that approximately equates with 1974 of the previous price run.

In spite of the fact that I am sure gold is headed to the 5 digit area, I prefer platinum because it is not currently a speculative asset. Although it is capable of taking a very deep temporary dive, it cannot go down in price for very long, because it costs more to produce (even after the recent price recovery) than they are selling it for. On top of this, the cost of producing it is rising at 10-20% per year.

Platinum is going to follow gold as a speculative asset, once the price inflation actually takes root, so it will have that premium, but it doesn't have the significant (medium term) downside risk.

1
Comment #18 by Anonymous posted on
Anonymous
Wanderer............If you read my above post you will see that I'm no fan of CDs nor have I had any CDs for over a decade now. 

1
Comment #20 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
I should further note that my definition of "speculative" is not the standard one. What I mean is that, if it does go down a few hundred dollars in price, the price will recover in that much time as it takes for mining companies to close more unprofitable mines. But, worldwide, given the growth of emerging markets, demand is going up, not down. Hedge fund managers who trade with computer algorithms made it go down last year, because the computers were picking up large numbers of headlines about European car sales, which, in reality, are just a part of the overall market. That was an excellent opportunity to buy, and I did. But, there is still a lot of upside left, especially long term, as it follows gold into speculative status, once the price inflation catches on.

1
Comment #21 by Anonymous posted on
Anonymous
Wanderer...........Ok, well I can't necessarily agree or disagree with 90% of what you said, mostly because I still don't know what you believe fair value is for gold, platinum or toilet paper for that matter. Of course, all three of those items are going to rise in price EVENTUALLY.............but that is of absolutely no comfort or value whatsoever because the price of pretty much everything will rise EVENTUALLY. Unless one can estimate the fair value of any asset it makes no sense whatsoever to accumulate that asset at the market value today, just because one can predict that the price will eventually go up. The stock market, real estate market, collector car market, collector coin market etc etc. will all eventually go up in value...............if for no other reason that future dollars will invarably be worth less than current dollars. That doesn't in any way help a person decide whether to accumulate something today or whether to wait til next week, next month or next year.

Anecdotally let me just say that I'm old enough to know several people who consistently accumulated gold in the 80's when it was doing the run up to $800. None of them had the fortitude to hold on to their holdings through the dark decades that followed. Perhaps this time will be different, but I can almost guarantee you that if the prices og gold or platinum do nothing more than hold in the current $1600-1700 range for a few more years, that there will be many many nerves that will be frayed among the "impatient" accumulators,...........perhaps yourself included.  

1
Comment #22 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
#21

I doubt that any of my nerves would be frayed at all by a standing still price, but, frankly speaking, the price of platinum cannot stand still. When we are talking about years, 5 years for example, the price must rise, even if there is no US based inflation, because there has been and is sure to continue to be heavy inflation in South Africa, and it is getting more and more expensive to mine it, because you need to dig deeper and the grades are ever poorer, and more expensive to extract. That's why I like platinum the best.

But, historically, 100% of every monetary inflation has ALWAYS and EVERYWHERE been paid back in price inflation. That is simply a fact of economic history and a principle that has never been violated. The USA won't be the only exception in the history of mankind. Given that it is the biggest debtor nation in world history, the payback is likely to be fast, furious and devastating when it finally arrives.

The true inflation is already rising at about 9% when downsized containers are considered, and will eventually rise a minimum of 400%, but probably a lot more given that the monetary inflation continues. That will certainly happen within 10 - 20 years, as historically, the gap in time has NEVER been larger than that. Usually, it has been less than 10 years.

So, the price of things like platinum, which is a consumable as well as a precious monetary metal, will always rise with inflation. So long as you don't pay an inflated price when you buy it, and it costs less, right now, to buy it, than to take it from the ground, I don't see any downside. With platinum, you have no possibility of being wiped out as you do if you get caught holding a 2% CD when the monetary inflation converts to price inflation. You don't have to pay taxes currently on the appreciation, year after year, at the "earned income" rate. And, when you do sell the stuff, you pay a slightly lower rate if you sell it at a coin shop, a much lower rate if you sell it in the futures markets, and only a 15% tax rate if you buy and then take a long-term capital gain on the Sprott trust (which is organized as a mutual fund).

So, again, I don't see any downside. Even if you miss the timing, as your friends did in 1980, and delay selling until after the inevitable bubble, and subsequent possible collapse, you are still way ahead of a long term CD. And, if you die before you sell, the basis rises to the metal's value at the time of your death, so your kids are even more infinitely better off, as they will pay no tax at all on all the pre-death capital gains.

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Comment #23 by Anonymous posted on
Anonymous
If gold is so wonderful......why are all of these places salavating to sell it to us? They tell us doomsday is right around the corner and thus we MUST have gold......and yet they are perfectly willing to sell their gold  to us. Hmmmmmmm. No thanks. It may be a decent investment and ok for some. But I'm certain you get hosed when you try to sell it

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Comment #24 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
Who is trying to sell you gold?

Most of the folks who advertising are trying to buy, not sell. They are usually offering to buy old jewelry from unsuspecting fools for ultra-cheap. Then, they melt it down, and sell it for much more on the world market, converting their profits into gold owned by themselves, houses, cars and other goodies.

There are a few who try to aggressively sell gold, but they are usually charging huge premiums. Don't buy from them. Buy only from dealers that charge the lowest premiums. But, forget about gold. In my humble opinion, platinum is much better. Admittedly, the upside is a bit less because there is no likelihood that the Fed will turn to platinum assets to balance their imploding toxic assets, as it doesn't have any. But the downside is almost zero because it is selling for less than it costs to take it from the ground, and it will respond to price inflation similar to gold, when the monetary inflation turns into price inflation.

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Comment #25 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
I should qualify that by saying that the long-term downside is zero. Anything could happen in the short-run, like the next few months, because of the various manipulations by Wall Street casino bankers like Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan and their associated hedge funds.

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Comment #26 by ytytytyt posted on
ytytytyt
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Dear Wanderer (anonymous) - #25,

Do you have any recommendation in addition to Kitco? Will like to know any tips/hints about choosing the right dealer.

Yours Truly,
Anonymous

2
Comment #27 by ytytytyt posted on
ytytytyt
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Dear #21 and Wanderer,

Have you given though to earning periodic dividends by becoming the landlord of the Government vis-a-vis the potential the metals have for capital appreciation? Government perhaps is the best tenant one can have with long leases and infinitesimally small chance of a missed rent payment.

Dividend payment is periodic/continuous and nearly assured for REIT, as against that the capital appreciation of metals may or may not materialize and if it comes about may happen at an unpredicatble time-frame.

Also, if you were to act as devil's advocate and make a case against investing (long-term buy-n-hold) for precious metals, then what would that be?

Yours Truly,
Anonymous

2
Comment #28 by ytytytyt posted on
ytytytyt
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Dear #15,

I agree that the 4% or 5% rate on CDs will most likely be matched by the corresponding inflation. So the number will look much better than what it is presently, but the effect after accounting for inflation will be no net gain.

(a) A factor that perhaps will be act to overcome the above will be the introduction of another asset - one's home - and the mortgage (if any) one has.  If one has locked-in the mortgage at fixed rate, and then if the inflation rate - LIBOR rate - CD rate all rise then the savings one will have for locked mortgage-payment can be significant.

(b) Last month the bonds have moved down. It is possible that this is a result or normal regression-to-mean or rise in inflation or something else.  No matter, if/when the inflation will begin in the earnest, the bonds will start going down futher and futher.  Shorting the bonds will not merely protect against the inflation, but actually will be beneficial.

(c) TIPs by US and other sovernignnations.

Any thoughts on these lines to actually benefit from the inflation?

Yours Truly,
Anonymous

 

2
Comment #29 by Wanderer (anonymous) posted on
Wanderer
Yours truly,

I am a student of economic history, and it tells me that there has NEVER been one occasion upon which monetary inflation did not eventually convert into an equal amount of price inflation. For this reason, I cannot make a devil's advocate's case against long term precious metals ownership. The only anti-precious metals argument that can be made is a short-term one.

I don't like REITS because once rates rise significantly, the value of real estate is going to fall dramatically. It may happen after the price inflation has already gone so far as to make the eventual capital appreciation very big compared to prices now. But, I am not a gambler by nature. I like sure things, which is why I like platinum better than gold. There is also a big overhang of inventory both in residential and commercial real estate.

I am not a member of the cabal who control the Federal Reserve and other central banks, so I don't know when they will voluntarily allow rates to rise. Nor, if they refuse to allow rising rates voluntarily, do I know exactly when they will be involuntarily forced sharply upward. Because that is going to happen, at least temporarily, one way or the other, especially when high inflation becomes more onerous, and the Fed feels compelled to stop printing.

I also don't know when the pain of stopping the printing presses will get so high that they will throw caution to the wind, and go back to printing into infinity, finally burying the Federal Reserve Note in the dustpan of history. Eventually, the Fed will involuntarily lose complete control, just as the Reichsbank did back in 1922, but because of all the unpredictable issues, I would only be a buyer of personal housing at this time, not REITS.

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Comment #30 by ytytytyt posted on
ytytytyt
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Dear Wanderer,

Thanks for stating your opinion so clearly.  It is not often that one gets to hear the view/perspective that is quite different and compel one to re-examine one's own short-term tactic and long-term strategy.

The target "inflation" and "job-less number" set by the FOMC, I believe make it crystal clear the reactionary mode of the uncoming decision making. ... We will have to wait and watch how the things develop (or deteriorate) over coming months/quarters/years.  Fiat system makes the population of the whole world subject to the decisions made by the central bankers across the world.

German history is fascinating.  Herr Schacht's scheme of mefo bills demonstrates how it is possible to circumvent even a system as loose as the Fiat system.

Yours Truly,
Anonymous

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Comment #31 by ytytytyt posted on
ytytytyt
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Dear Readers,

Some text that describes inflation, un-employment, role of central bank, and creation of money from mefo bills is at URL below:

http://www.fourhourday.org/content/docs/Hjalmar%20Schacht.pdf

Yours Truly,
Anonymous

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Comment #35 by Anonymous posted on
Anonymous
Wanderer.........Don't be so sure about the inevitable rise of platinum or the inevitale rise of any industrial metal...........just because of your perceptions of mining costs. It is precisely that type of logic & inference that led many analysts over the years  to suggest that prices have  nowhere to go but up  on a laundry list of metals just because it costs X amount of dollars to extract this or that.................& that the world couldn't possibly exist without consuming more & more of whatever they were talking about.

It is precisely that type of thinking that produced countless books over the last 40 years that argued with almost certainty that we would have run out of oil by now.................or that at the very least oil would be many hundreds of dollars more per barrel then it is today.  The truth of course is that we're still quite far away from that eventuality. Technology does advance, new supplies come on line (especially when prices rise) South Africa may be the dominant producer today..............but maybe not tomorrow. Maybe itll be Timbuktu, Mali as a future major producer for all you know. :)




  

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Comment #36 by ytytyt posted on
ytytyt
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Dear Wanderer,

Bid/Ask spread for both PPLT and PALL appears rather large, and volume appears rather small.  SPPP volume and spread are a little better. This will need a consideration when I begin trading these.

I'm comparing with GLD for which the volume is very large, and spread almost always is just a penny.

Your Truly,
Anonymous

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Comment #37 by cumulus posted on
cumulus
> The highest CD rate that's nationally available continues to be at
> Citizens State Bank which is offering a 5-year CD with a 2.05% APY.
>
Citizens just cut .25% from this today; new APY=1.80%.

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