Warning Posting Process!!!!

This is something I've complained about before about other places. Deposits should always be processed first -- geez, the have it that day and they only process once a day! But if not, at least process things in the order they were presented; don't rearrange them so you can collect bounced fees for things that there was no reason to bounce. 

Some banks even rearrange things to process the bigger checks before the smaller checks, and that way if you bounce, there is more chance that you will bounce multiple checks causing multiple penalties rather than just the single big check.

I've complained of this kind of practice about Alliant Credit Unioin. They have an online feeature whereby you can schedule a transfer from one account to another in advance. So, say two weeks in advance, you schedule a transfer into your checking account of $500 for April 15. And on April 15, you have a ACH bill come through for $500. They will process the bill first thing in the morning, and not process the deposit until late at night -- causing the withdrawal to bouce and them to collect a penalty fee. Geez, you set up the deposit with them two weeks earlier, but they processed the withdrawal that only came in that day first and bounced you even though their record shows them they are to make that deposit!

I have complained to Alliant bitterly about this -- to no avail. So, unfortunately, Altra FCU is not alone.

The local credit union I use places a hold on checks I deposit.  Even checks I write from ME from a different bank.  So even though it is reflected in my current balance, (and they pay interest on it immediately), I could not use that money to pay a bill the same day...  because it is NOT reflected in my available balance.

The reason that has not been a problem, is because I use the other money that has been there in the account to pay bills, etc.  If I had a zero balance before I made my deposit, and I set up bills to be paid that same day...  I would also be in the situation you described. 

Unless I do not understand what you said, I would say that is a common practice in many institutions.

Yes, MIke, you're missing my point. And I think Redbutler's too. I'm talking of cash, and he might very well be too.

I'm talking of direct cash deposit transferred from another in-house Alliant account, which is not subject to a hold as a check is. The issue isn't it being in the account but not cleared and available. The issue is they specifically don't put it in the account until the day is over and they have processed all other incoming debits first --  and so you can't use it until a day later! That is, you set up the transfer in advance to be in there that day so you can use it that day, but they don't put it in until the day is over and so you can't use it at all that day, and meanwhile they are bouncing incoming bill payments or other ACH debits all day long and charging you a penalty fee for each. To use it that day, you would have to put it in a day in advance. That gets them a free float day because they don't pay interest on the checking account for that extra day.

Mind you, if you did the transfer on that very day, the money is transferred immediately and available immediately. But if you set the transfer up in advance, giving them lots of extra time to deal with it, it won't be done until late that night. Having had extra time for the processing, I see no reason why it isn't already set to be in the account by the time the clock strikes 12:01 a.m. that day. But they can collect a bunch of penalty fees if they do it as they are doing it.

me1004, thanks for the clarification. 

I don't think I've experienced the same situation.  You've suggested some work arounds within your clarification, so you know how to avoid it.  But I see your point, too.  It is unclear to me why a manual transfer is immediate, while a previously setup transfer has an end of day "delay."  At the absolute very least, the institution ought to clearly explain when the future transfer/deposit will be effective...  they should be clear to the very minute.

In addition, if the funds were present at the institution the whole time, just in a connected account (from which they were clearly setup already to come from to meet the various debt obligations), it seems a bit reaching to wack the customer with a bunch of fees. 

The days of free overdraft protection sound really good, don't they?  Under that model, it didn't even matter if you had setup a transfer to cover the debts...  the bank covered them for you, from your other account...  automatically.

But then, fees are the new working model for banks, thanks to our intellectual regulators.

Given that transfer, deposit, and debit policies vary from institution to institution, it would appear the best way to avoid needless increases in one's blood pressure would be to schedule deposits for the day prior to any scheduled withdrawals.  The interest gained by playing a zero balance game (matching same day deposits/withdrawals) hardly seems worth the extra aggravation.  I find Alliant's external transfer policy (funds transferred via ACH by noon CST arrive at the receiving institution the next day) worth the slight hassle of scheduling deposits (even internal) one day early.

Several of the large banks were fined several  million dollars because they ran larger checks thru their customer accounts before the smaller checks.   Money is being  refunded to cusomers if they were victims. Maybe you should do a google on your bank if this happened to you.

I actually started a thread about Alliant on this practice about six months ago -- after I found out by getting hit with a bounce fee. I argued with them for a good week, and they would not budge and change the policy. 

Regarding notice: they think they are clear. But all they notify you of is that the transfer will be "processed" the evening of the scheduled day. They do not tell you that incoming debits will be processed first all day long as they come in -- so I was left thinking that I didn't care when they processed it because it was there and would cover debits, which I presumed also were processed at the same time in the evening. They leave that little detail out of their notice! I thought that about all the notice was informing me of was that I would not see the transfer listed in my account until they processed that evening.

So, I no longer use the advance setup for a transfer, instead mark my calendar and do it that day so it is in there right away. Thanks for nothing, Alliant. They could have had a great service and made customers very happy, but instead make me feel cheated.

Mike, as for the options to cover overdrafts automatically, all that serves is to pay the debit; you still have to pay a fee when it happens -- I've never seen that offered free. So, it doesn't protect you from a penalty, simply doesn't bounce the debit. That's why banks push that service, they make money off it. And it would still leave that point we're discussing the same, that I would get hit with a fee when I should not have been.

In an aside, Alan, I haven't used the Alliant ACH outgoing since they changed that processing time. Are you saying that it still doesn't get to the other bank until the next day? I thought that was to speed it there by the end of the current day -- they said that earlier time was to speed it through. All other banks I KNOW of put things into the ACH in the evening, as Alliant used to do, I thought, and it arrives overnight. So, how would moving the processing to noon "speed" it if it isn't getting there until the next morning anyway? In fact, it means that things put in in the afternoon won't get there for two days instead of one, slowing the process for them! Was that talk of a speedup really just some public relations language to cover up what was really a slow down?

Rosie, yes, I saw that recently. And a few months ago there was another similar case that was settled, I forget against whom. But I sent that one to Alliant and raised the issue again, and all they did was try to find some minute little thing in that case that they could say made it so it didn't apply to them -- and I told them that they missed the point. I also had pointed out to them originally that Wells Fargo was prosecuted some years back, about 10 years ago, by the California Attorney General for processing large checks before smaller ones, in order to bounce as many checks as possible, and had to pay a very large fine on the theory that the practice was designed to bounce checks and collect fees, just as the Alliant practice would seem to be -- but they still didn't get the point. They will not budge from their practice -- I suppose not until someone prosecutes them too. They haven't even fixed their insufficient notice, which I complained about.

Correction re:  Alliant ACH transfers.  My experience has been that all Alliant ACH transfers initiated by Noon CST have appeared on my account statement at the receiving bank/CU the next morning.

Please note - Altra posts credit before debits. All ACH credits are posted first, then debits. Checks that come in for a particular day are cleared in numeric order at the end of that business day. We do everything possible to give the member most advantageous posting order.

The only exception is Debit card PIN purchases or ATM withdrawals are posted as they occur and a check cashed at one of our branches will clear immediately.

If you'd like to discuss, please stop in or call our Member Service center. We'd be happy to discuss further.

me1004 #7, I knew they did exist once...  free overdrafts STILL exist.

Mike, as for the options to cover overdrafts automatically, all that serves is to pay the debit; you still have to pay a fee when it happens -- I've never seen that offered free. So, it doesn't protect you from a penalty, simply doesn't bounce the debit. That's why banks push that service, they make money off it. And it would still leave that point we're discussing the same, that I would get hit with a fee when I should not have been.

It is only available to some, but this is just one example.  I imagine if it is here, it is still available somewhere else too.

http://www.peopleschoicecreditunion.com/services/free4me-checking

Oops! Refund. Life gets crazy sometimes.
We won’t punish you for a couple of overdraft – oversights…