Missing POD On CD At Bank

James9909 | Feb 27, 2018 | 5 posts since 2018

My mother passed away 3 months ago leaving behind no will. She felt it was rather simple as I was the only heir to the estate. Her other son(my brother) who passed away 6 years ago, has two daughters we haven't heard from in nearly 5 years. I understand anything belonging to the estate will be 50% theirs(25% each) and 50% mine. Fortunately all her banking and investment accounts had me listed as POD, on every single one. Except one.

The account in question is a sizeable CD at a larger institution. I was present with my mother for all her banking and financial matters to ensure she was of sound mind when she made them and she made sure I was listed solely as POD on every account she owned. When transferring money here and setting up a second CD my mother did as she normally did and listed me as POD, and I witnessed that. Now, to my surprise, the institution is saying they do not have that on file and I cannot find my mother's original copy. They refuse to provide any paperwork even though I am the administrator of the estate, and the original Agent of the institution will not return my numerous phone calls and her office tells me I can just call corporate as there is nothing she can assist me with. I find their behavior very suspect...

As stated, I know for a fact I was listed as POD. I'm not one to seek litigation but I truly feel their negligence is about to significantly cost me! What should I do?

1

Answers

Kaight | Feb 27, 2018 | 1,192 posts since 2011

Really am not seeing your dilemma. In your situation it seems even more straightforward if there is no POD. You just present one of your letters of administration to the bank and request the money. You state you are administrator so I assume you have received your letters of administration. That is all you need, along perhaps with proof of your identity. If the bank is not local you will have to mail to the bank the documentation they require before they can release the funds to you.

Now if you were not the administrator, it would be a different matter entirely. But you say you are, so I'm assuming the court has granted you that status.

I have actually been in your situation, received those letters, and done what needed doing . . . all without paid legal assistance. However, this sort of thing is governed by state law and procedures might be different in your state.

1

alan1 | Feb 27, 2018 | 877 posts since 2015

I think James9909's dilemma does not arise from his capacity as administrator. I think it arises from the issue of whether he is the beneficiary. As beneficiary, he would get 100%. Acting as administrator, the estate would get 100%. Then, James9909, as an heir, would get 50%. I think his dilemma can be precisely quantified - it's 50% of the value of the account.

4

Kaight | Feb 27, 2018 | 1,192 posts since 2011

I think we agree, alan1. Certainly the OP would be responsible, as administrator, to locate other beneficiaries and make a proper distribution of the bank account's proceeds. Were he to defraud other legitimate beneficiaries, he would be a good candidate for a lawsuit!

But in my experience, all that is not a concern for the bank, provided OP has and presents the requisite court papers (letter of administration). Absent that document, of course, it is an ENTIRELY different situation. The OP has stated he is administrator, but he has not said that status was officially conferred upon him by the court.

1

Anon1234 | Feb 27, 2018 | 114 posts since 2010

Kaight, the dilemma is that (a) as the administrator of the estate, I think the OP is held to an exacting standard as to the handling of the estate and (b) if the nieces (who have not been heard from in 5 years) were to challenge the estate for their 25% share each, the person would have to transfer those funds to them.

Just because the OP knows that the account was titled with the POD in their favor does not mean that they can take possession of the funds without the supporting documentation to justify the distribution.

4

Anon1234 | Feb 27, 2018 | 114 posts since 2010

To clarify the last sentence in my post, as the administrator OP can certainly take possession of the funds. However he cannot distribute them 100% to himself even though he says he knows it was POD to him if the documentation does not support the distribution.

3

James9909 | Feb 27, 2018 | 5 posts since 2018

Thanks for the comments so far! Allow me to clarify...
I have been appointed administrator of the estate, and nieces have been notified of this and all accounts including POD information. The bank was willing to issue the funds to the estate, which is where the money will sit. While I have no intentions to defraud anyone nor am in a rush to distribute anything for myself or others, I am seeking to find the original instrument that would show me as POD. The response from Alan1 is exactly the dilemma. My question is what are my options to avoid losing 50% due to a bank error?

2

Kaight | Feb 27, 2018 | 1,192 posts since 2011

Whoa! Seeing it differently now. Absent documentation, I think you have lost half your money.

1

Kaight | Feb 27, 2018 | 1,192 posts since 2011

Well, first of all, I agree with everything in your first paragraph. Point is it's the court, and not the bank, that holds OP to the duty of making an equitable distribution of the funds. If OP commits fraud by attempting to disinherit other family members, he will face real trouble.

My take on your second paragraph is that OP is entitled to receive the funds from the bank simply because he presents his Letter of Administration. This is true since the bank is claiming there is no POD. In this instance, it is almost helpful to the OP that there is no POD . . . provided of course that he has and presents that Letter of Administration from the court.

1

James9909 | Feb 27, 2018 | 5 posts since 2018

Thanks for the input Kaight. While the court does hold me to the duty of making an equitable distribution, and that is how we are moving forward on other assets, that would only pertain to accounts with no POD...such as this one. POD allows me to bypass the courts and the estate and would allow this account to roll over entirely to me, as it was setup to do. I am simply seeking to correct a bank error that is causing me to lose out on 50% of this sole account to my neices.

3

alan1 | Feb 27, 2018 | 877 posts since 2015

James9909 -- perhaps you can clarify things -- I _think_ the people who have responded are reading your posting in different ways. Is your concern that, as administrator, you are not able to obtain the funds for the estate? Or, is it that you want the bank to pay the funds to you as beneficiary, but the bank has not located (or perhaps even looked for) documentation as to whether the account owner designated a beneficiary?

1

alan1 | Feb 27, 2018 | 877 posts since 2015

James 9909 -- I see you clarified the issue, while I was typing a request for clarification.

1

James9909 | Feb 27, 2018 | 5 posts since 2018

As administrator and having letters of administration issued by the courts and presented to the bank, the bank was will to and has issued funds to the estate account. The dilemma is that the bank cannot provide the original documentation that I witnessed signatures on naming me sole beneficiary and they claim there is none. Without that, this account becomes an asset of the estate meaning I will get 50% and neices will share the other 50%, instead of myself retaining 100% as designed.

1

Kaight | Feb 27, 2018 | 1,192 posts since 2011

To the OP:

You stated there are other accounts, all set up as POD. If all of those accounts are set up with you alone as beneficiary, that would strengthen your case in court it seems to me when trying to demonstrate bank failure regarding the account in question.

1

alan1 | Feb 27, 2018 | 877 posts since 2015

Whoa, James9909. Maybe it's time for you to consult an attorney before doing anything further. Maybe not.
It _might_ be the case that once the funds are paid to the Estate, the administrator will have to distribute them in accordance with the state law on intestacy, even if the bank has records somewhere indicating there was a beneficiary. Even if not, the grandchildren might be able to make an arguable case. Perhaps you (as a possible beneficiary on the CD) would be better off first trying to get the bank to search its records for the original documentation (or, any other documentation, paper or electronic) that might shed light on the issue of whether the account holder named a beneficiary..

I do not know the best course, practically or legally. But once the bank issues a check to the estate, I suspect they're much less likely to search through their records. You may want to consider writing a letter to the appropriate person or unit of the bank asking for them to provide the administrator with documentation as to whether a beneficiary was designated (include documentation demonstrating that you are the administrator). If the bank has no records showing a beneficiary (or says it has no such records) and you have no such records, then you'll wind up with 50% as an heir. I believe your best shot at getting 100% as a beneficiary is to try to get records from the bank, before it issues a check to the estate.

1

alan1 | Feb 27, 2018 | 877 posts since 2015

James9909-- I was typing the above, while you were posting that the bank had already paid the money to the Estate. My understanding, and it may be wrong, is that generally you're out of luck without documentation that you were named as a beneficiary. And even if you come up with such documentation in the future (say you find a copy of what appears to be original paperwork in the dedcedent's personal records), I don't know whether it would help you. The bank paid the money to the estate; the adminiatrator accepted the check and the funds are in the Estate's account. I suspect the administrator should distribute the funds as per state law on intestacy. But it may be worth speaking to an attorney.

1

alan1 | Feb 27, 2018 | 877 posts since 2015

Freudian typo -- should be "decedent" (not "dedcedent")

1

Kaight | Feb 27, 2018 | 1,192 posts since 2011

Yeah, wow, a really tough situation. Problem is how does one force or compel a bank to put in the time to search for critical documents when there is no profit for the bank in performing this service?

If the bank stands unwilling to assist voluntarily, I know of no other way except to hire a lawyer and threaten to sue them if they remain unwilling to produce the original paperwork. And, boy, that is a really undesirable option. Perhaps a lawyer would have a better idea. Perhaps just a threatening letter from the lawyer would be enough to move the bank to serious action.

That original paperwork, or at least a copy thereof, has to be somewhere.

1

James9909 | Feb 27, 2018 | 5 posts since 2018

I appreciate everyone's comments. I can't stand the thought of having to pay out these brats(neices). I know the courts will have nothing to do with this, but I would hope that if an attorney could present the facts that:
1) Every account is POD only to myself, including another CD through this same institution
2) I was present and witnessed my Mother sign the document in question and make me beneficiary
3) The Agent and Agencies avoidance to correspond regarding this matter
- then surely that would help my case. I'd rather take a sleezy attorney that wants a hefty chunk of a settlement to try and get somewhere or even spend money out of the principle. With large corporations eager to settle, it almost seems worth it... I think it's time to lawyer up, unfortunately.

1

Kaight | Feb 27, 2018 | 1,192 posts since 2011

OK, that (#1) is new information and it is helpful. I would not lawyer up immediately. I would instead collect paperwork from every other CD, including the one from this bank. I would take that paperwork, in person, into the bank and seek to speak with the highest ranking person I could. I would insist that person examine all those documents, making thereby a strong case for your mom's pattern and practice when opening ANY new CD. And then I would press my case as vigorously as possible . . . in person . . . regarding need for them to produce the original CD paperwork or a copy thereof.

One other thing I would do and present together with the above:

I would draw up and sign, before a notary, an affidavit attesting formally to the fact you witnessed your mom signing a form for the CD naming you as sole beneficiary in a POD situation. If you know the date she signed so much the better. Include it. If you're able to recall time of day and place, include those details. I would offer the affidavit to the bank. Realize, of course, that if you lie on an affidavit you can be sued and could land in jail. So make certain every word of the document you sign is the absolute truth. If you cannot recall something, leave it out. Do not guess.

A formal, written document like that should carry more weight with a bank officer than just your spoken word. And it will indicate to them your extreme seriousness regarding this matter. All this I would try before engaging the services of a lawyer.

1

paoli2 | Feb 27, 2018 | 2,641 posts since 2011

Reading these posts makes it so clear how important it is for the person who is the POD on anyone's CD to be given a copy of that CD! If the poster had his copy he would not have to be concerned whether he was Administrator or not. The ball was dropped when he did not make sure he had that CD to turn in to the bank upon the owner's death. I don't think the bank has to turn over the funds just because we give them an affidavit. Our CDs strictly read the original must be turned into the institution and signed at that time before the funds can be turned over to the "owner" of the CD. The owner in this case would have been the poster if he had the CD showing his name as POD. I always ask my institutions exactly what does my POD person have to do at my demise to collect the funds if they are listed as POD or beneficiary and it is the same. Turn in the CD to them with your name listed as POD or beneficiary. Plus a copy of the death certificate showing the original owner has passed. It's that simple.

1

The financial institution, product, and APY (Annual Percentage Yield) data displayed on this website is gathered from various sources and may not reflect all of the offers available in your region. Although we strive to provide the most accurate data possible, we cannot guarantee its accuracy. The content displayed is for general information purposes only; always verify account details and availability with the financial institution before opening an account. Contact [email protected] to report inaccurate info or to request offers be included in this website. We are not affiliated with the financial institutions included in this website.